Mitch Cunningham on Ridgmont Farm and Storm Boy

0:00 Touring the farm and its new foaling unit

George 0:00 Our podcasts, Off N Racing, we're joined by Mitch Cunningham out here at his beautiful Ridgemont Farm. Thanks for coming on Mitch. Thanks George, thanks for coming. You just took us on a tour before while we were waiting on Dave. But no, beautiful mate, the infrastructure you're putting in here, it's incredible what you're building. Yeah, look, it's, I guess the investment or the capital expenditure it takes to build a farm up to the scale is significant. And we're right in the,

Mitch Cunningham 0:29 in the throes of that at the moment. The farm will change landscape material over the next few years and, and we, we're really excited about some of the projects we've got on the go at the moment. I've just taken you boys up to our, our new foaling unit, which, which will be ready for the season, which is exciting. So that'll be state of the art and, and hopefully we have best practice in that department, which is so key to the, you know, it's the first phase of life for our, for our, our horses on the farm. And if that's a good experience for both, mayor and foaling, we, we, we feel like that's a, that's a great start for them. You know, we are, we've got a lot going on and it's, it's a significant undertaking, but we're enjoying it for sure.

George 1:11 Have you found it hard to juggle all the infrastructure and the buildings going on with still trying to run a functioning farm? Because you had, still had some fantastic results at the recent Inglis Easter sale.

Mitch Cunningham 1:22 Yeah. I'd say George, that's, that's not me juggling anything. It's just, we've got really good staff, you know, I've got the team who managed the place, do an incredible job. You know, I'm learning things from them every day. I'm not, not sort of long for this game. I've only been in it for a few years. And so, you know, we focus primarily on getting key people to the farm who we felt could take us to where, you know, take us to those lofty ambitious heights we want to take the place. And so we were aggressive with, with who we, who we brought to the farm in management positions. And so, as you say, juggling the infrastructure projects of the farm along with, you know, preparing the yearlings along with our racing arm is, is obviously a significant undertaking made, made a lot easier by the staff we have here.

2:15 How many mares the farm will carry

George 2:15 How many horses do you want to get to? Do you have a goal?

Mitch Cunningham 2:17 We're probably, I would, at the moment we've got about 45 mers on the farm. We've scaled that right back from about 80 in the last few months to give us the latitude to put in place our practices and our, you know, infrastructure in order to grow in a more manageable way. I think an ideal number for a farm of this sort of, I guess, footprint would be in the order of 80, 90 mers. And we could, we can, we can handle that very comfortably. That wouldn't be even close to overstocking the farm. So we'll go, we'll move towards that, but it will be an organic slow growth to that point. We're not in a rush.

3:08 Ten years as a Cathay Pacific pilot

George 3:08 You've got, um, definitely one of the more interesting backgrounds of anyone that I've come across in the industry. You've, the farm itself's quite in its infancy, but you were a pilot and then you had, you did that for 10 years, was it? And in Hong Kong?

Mitch Cunningham 3:26 Yeah. Yeah. I, uh, I was flying, uh, for Cathay Pacific in Hong Kong. It's a Hong Kong based airline and, and, uh, I was there for 10 years. I was on the 747 and the 777 while I was there. And, and, um, yeah, yeah, yeah. We're building all that work up. There's the runway we're building. Um, so I don't, I don't remember how to do it anymore. So I'd be terrified too. Um, so yeah, we were there for 10 years, um, my wife and I, and then we started having kids. Uh, Hong Kong is such a great place. I don't know if you guys have been there, but it's just like the racing there for one is, you know, probably the funnest racing I've ever experienced. They do it totally differently. Um, but Hong Kong is, is, I feel, um, more of a, uh, young person's town where, where you're not really worried about.

George 4:28 Yeah. You'd raise a fan.

Mitch Cunningham 4:29 It's just tough once you start looking at it like that and space is pretty confined there and it's incredibly expensive to live there. And backyards are rare, uh, parks are rare. Um, so, you know, it's, it's a pretty fast place to live. But once we started having kids, we started reassessing really where we wanted to, how we wanted to live. Um, being an airline pilot is typically one of those things that people are just deeply passionate about being. It's been their life's ambition to, to be a pilot. Whereas for me, it wasn't that. And, and, uh, you know, it's pretty unusual for someone to be with an airline for 10 years and then just leave. You know, um, I think most people go into that career with the view that it's, that's them done. You know, they've probably been working their whole life to get to the airlines. They get to the airlines and then they get their sort of payday and, and it's, they're in clover. Whereas for me, it was a bit of a different path. And I guess the same way I've come into the horses is the same way I got into the, the aviation side of things. And it was non-traditional. I, I, um, I didn't have any flying experience before I got into Cathay. I got a cadetship where they take, it's like, it's, it's a, it's a relatively significant recruitment process, but basically they're looking for untrained pilots. And they come in and they, uh, they pay for your, uh, flying. Uh, you live with them for two years at a training facility. And then once you finished your, you owe a return of service effectively. So you join the airline and you work your way up through the airline. So I did that in a, in a, in a pretty non-traditional way. And maybe that hardened my mind in, in that you don't necessarily have those traditional obstacles that people might see as a barrier to entry. Uh, you know, so when I, when I started having kids, uh, I think the novelty of being away so much, wore off and I really craved just being at home with the kids and with, with, uh, with my wife. And I just sort of, I suppose, started seeing things a bit differently and, and, um, started plotting my path into, into a new career.

6:39 Coming home from Hong Kong

George 6:39 And then you didn't just go straight into the horses. You, you had a couple of, was it gyms and stuff? Yeah, yeah.

Mitch Cunningham 6:46 Well, no, I, I, I, the, the gyms were, they came second to the horses. I came back from Hong Kong in 2018, I think it was. And, um, it was off the back of a conversation with my father who, uh, you know, we, we'd always been into racing, but at a hobbyist level. And my father and my younger brother and I were spending most of our weekends watching races and, and just loving it. And, you know, moving into race horse ownership, uh, for the first time. And we started having discussions around, you know, maybe there was something we could do in more earnest in the industry together. Uh, we didn't know what that looked like at the time. It was probably more at the time looking at the racing side of things and, and what we could do there. Um, but.

George 7:41 Most people buy a few shares. Yeah. You bought a farm. Yeah.

7:45 A So You Think filly and buying the farm

Mitch Cunningham 7:45 Well, we had, we, we had that, we had that typical experience of your first race horse being a really good one. Yeah. And then everything downhill from there. That was like. That was light up the room. So that was off, off, uh, your old place. Yeah. Yeah. I worked at the mayor. So. And she was just a ripper. She was so you think Philly. We bought for, I think 120,000. Uh, I think it was so you think second season or something, was it? Anyway, he, um, he was, he was obviously such a champion, uh, uh, uh, race horse himself. And, and we loved him. And so we bought this, this Philly. I can't say it was anything more than closing our eyes and throwing a dart at a dartboard, frankly. Like it's, there's no genius in what we did, but we got a good one. Um, and so, and so.

George 8:34 Who picked that horse? Uh, John Foote. John Foote. Yeah. Yeah.

Mitch Cunningham 8:37 Uh, and so we raced her. She was, she was pre-Christmas two-year-old, which was, as I say, you think is, as you both know, pretty unusual. Um, and then she just started winning and, and she was multiple stakes placed and, and was just a, uh, as far as horses go, frankly, she was top shelf. You know, like not many of them go on and do that. Um, so she was maybe a bit of a poison challenge cause she sucked us right in and, uh, it was all over from there. And, and, and so we had such a good experience with her that, you know, the whole family started really, uh, I guess, drinking the Kool-Aid and, and, um, we just became immersed in it. And I decided, uh, with, I guess, much, um, encouragement from, from, uh, my dad, Gary, uh, to start exploring, you know, different opportunities for us. And, and so I guess long story short, I moved home, packed up, resigned from Cathay, came back to Australia. And within, I think six months we had bought Glastonbury Farm, uh, which was the, the, the, uh, initial 220 acres of what is now 550 acres here. Yeah. And, uh, rebadged at Ridgemont and, and we're sort of drinking from a fire hose from that point on.

10:06 Living on the farm and learning from staff

George 10:06 And you live on the farm now, so you've gone from Hong Kong to Scorn. Yeah, yeah.

Mitch Cunningham 10:10 I live just there with the kids. I've just moved down in December. Yeah. But I was commuting back and forth before that. Again, I sort of found myself in a position where I was just repeating history and then I was, you know, away a lot. And that's just not what was the design for all of this. And so we, um, we all moved down as a family and, and, uh, my wife and kids are just loving it. The schools here are unbelievable. And my wife is the most adaptable person ever. So she's, she's just, uh, in boots and all and she loves it. And so we're really happy down there. And it's, it's, it's been the right move for us for sure.

George 10:46 And in the early stages, you had a few, um, partners involved in it, but now it's just the Cunningham. Yeah. Yeah. It's just us.

Mitch Cunningham 10:53 We've got, we've got, um, we've got the racing arm, which is Cunningham thoroughbreds. And we've got Ridgemont, which is owned by our family outright. So really the only separation between the two entities is one's racing, one's breeding in your farm.

George 11:07 And would you, you're obviously based here and you've got your staff, obviously Chris and everything do a great job. So you work with them to run the farm, but would your dad have much say in it then?

Mitch Cunningham 11:19 Dad's, dad's involved. Uh, I mean, if you've ever met him, you'd, you know, he's a, he's a pretty intelligent fellow who is a diehard racing tragic, just loves it. You know, he spends all his spare time, uh, watching racing and, and reading form and, but he's retired, you know, and he, he, um, I think his interest lies in the strategy for the farm and the strategy for what we're doing here. But he, uh, he involves himself when it's important for him to be involved outside of that. He's, he's, uh, he's enjoying his retirement.

George 12:02 Does he live on the farm?

Mitch Cunningham 12:04 No, he's on the Gold Coast. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. He's, he's sold up, he's sold up his house in Brisbane. He's, he's got no base there at all now. Plus he's, he's, uh, living that, that traditional retired life now in, um, on the Gold Coast and loving it.

George 12:21 And are you quite hands on on the farm?

Mitch Cunningham 12:24 Yeah, I'm, I'm hands on in, uh, so far as I'm learning, you know, how to be more hands on. So I'm, I'm involving myself, uh, and not trying to get in the way. I think you'd more, uh, look at it.

George 12:37 How would you go, like, leading the year? Yeah. Not great. Not great.

Mitch Cunningham 12:42 I'll have a crack, but not great. Yeah. Yeah. I spend a lot of my time in the office and, you know, there's, there's a hell of a lot going on with where we want to take the farm. And, and so that, that takes up a lot of my time, but you know, as, as much as I can, I involve myself on the farm and, and, um, that's more, more a product of me wanting to learn from, from the great people we have here.

George 13:03 No, it's good that like you acknowledge that and, you know, there's a lot of owners and that and wealthy owners and their egos that they think, oh, I don't need to learn. And I don't need to do that. So it's good. Even to the staff to acknowledge you want to learn. Yeah.

Mitch Cunningham 13:20 Well, that was, listen, that's the only reason we're in this is that if I was, yeah, I mean, you've never done learning. You know, I think, um, I'm not comparing myself in any way to Henry Field, but I saw a video the other day where Jim Carrey was speaking about Henry saying that Henry's so good at what he does because all he does is continue learning and continue teaching himself. And he can probably pick a yearling better than anyone. So I've got no ego in this. I have confidence in myself that I know how to run a business and I'm very confident where I'm taking this business. Um, but I would be, it would be counterproductive for me to pretend that I was, uh, an expert in areas where I'm a novice, you know, so I'm only a few years into this game and, and I, uh, hopefully I'll get to the point one day where I'm, where I'm, um, teaching the yearling manager how to lead yearlings, but, uh, that's not the case now.

14:19 Racing and breeding, and choosing trainers

George 14:19 Yeah, but if you're at that point and you're teaching your yearling manager how to lead a yearling, teach your yearling manager. Yeah, that's right. Maybe I should not. There's a lesson I've just learned. Yeah. So which areas like interest you the most? The maintenance, the breeding? Yeah, yeah.

Mitch Cunningham 14:33 I'm, I'm, um, obviously the, the, I'm, I'm more, I'm more, as far as the, um, racing arm and the breeding arm. I'm sort of one foot in both camp. I'm really interested in, in obviously the, the racing side of things, but the, the, the truth of racing, as you both know, in what you guys do is once you've bought the yearling and you've given it to a trainer, the, you can involve yourself in it, but you're entrusting the trainer to, to, um, take that, that horse to the heights it's going to get to. Right. And, and so, you know, I, I don't involve myself day to day on, you know, what the trainer did that morning, you know, and did it eat up its feed and did it, you know, like it's, and placements and all that sort of stuff. Like I involve myself where I think it's important and I've got a good relationship with all our trainers, but they know that I'm, I'm a relatively passive, um, race horse owner in that capacity. I mean, we're very professional with how we select our yearlings and, and, and we're pretty clear on, on the sort of horse, I guess the, the avatar that we're trying to buy at a yearling sale. And, and with that said though, it's, it's not, I'm not meddling in, in what these, these trainers are doing. Um, so my time is most spent, you know, on the farm, you know, uh, breeding side of things and the matings and, and then from there it's just strategy, you know, it's where do we want to take the farm? How are we going to allocate, uh, capital and, and, you know, how are we going to get this business to where it needs to go? Cause at the moment, you know, it's, we're, we're, we're still working towards, uh, profitability. You know, it's an expensive exercise to get a farm, uh, to be, to turn a profit and, you know, we're still young, but I know the path that we're going to take to get there. It's just making sure that we're on path towards that and taking the right steps every day towards, towards getting this to where it needs to go. Where you really make a decision is buying the horse and understanding what you think this horse is going to be and what sort of profile this horse is and then assigning it to an appropriate trainer. Right. And then by, by that very decision, you have understood that they train in a certain way and that is an appropriate style for that horse. Um, and so really if that doesn't marry up, it's probably comes back to making the wrong decision for trainer, uh, you know, and, and, and as, as you get further into those relationships with trainers, you understand how they train, how they communicate. And, um, you can't be surprised when your expectations aren't met, you know, say you send a horse to Chris Waller, for instance, who's, you know, we send horses to and we have a great experience with, he's, you know, arguably the best trainer in the country, but you can't send a horse to Chris Waller and expect to be getting phone calls from Chris Waller all the time. Right. So, um, it's, it's, you know, equally, um, you know, there's, there's horses, there's trainers that, you know, are very good with two year olds, there's trainers that are very good with stays, there's trainers that are, uh, you know, very good with improving tried horses, you know, so there's a whole plethora of training styles. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Exactly. So we, we, we have a lot of trainers we work with and we understand what to expect when we send horses to them and we let them do their thing. Yeah.

18:17 Buying yearlings and tried horses

George 18:17 And you've got, you talk about your strategies and stuff. So when you do get involved in the horse, cause you've got, um, some runners this weekend, say for instance, mostly cloudy in the Sydney cup, you got a Sharon Swartz. Yeah. And you've had Steffi Magnetica, Storm Boy, like how do you, what's the strategy when you're getting involved in these horses?

Mitch Cunningham 18:39 So look, we, most of our horses we're involved in, we've bought as yearlings, I'd say 95% of them. Um, we're also pretty active in the tried horse market. So we've, we've, um, you know, we've gone over tattersalls and bought horses. We've, um.

George 18:55 Is that fillies or?

Mitch Cunningham 18:57 No, normally when we're buying, uh, normally when we're buying them over in, um, the UK, they'll be, they'll typically are geldings. Um, we bought one filly privately over there. We bought out Lolly Yates, who unfortunately had a, um, tendon issue, but she was a handy, uh, mare who, who, uh, she is now part of our broodmare band. But, you know, we, we normally, uh, buying them as yearlings. And so our involvement in, in most of our horses has been from day dot. Most cloudy, for instance, is, you know, I've got a, uh, uh, really good relationship with Trent Busson and Natalie Young and, and Guy Mollcaster. And they bought mostly cloudy at the horse and training sale last year. I think it was a horse and, anyway, it was at Tattersalls last year. Yeah. Two years ago. Um, and, um, we took majority share in, in him and he's just this out and out staying, uh, prospect who, who won over two miles at Ascot on his last run there and won by, you know, the length of the straight just about. So we bought him out. We bought into him at what we thought was a, um, relatively cheap price for what he had done. And, and he came out and he just was that traditional, uh, export who just didn't adapt very quickly. Had a woolly coat in summer and was just not looking, uh, good at all. And I think Trent was really concerned by, Trent and Nat were pretty concerned with how he looked. And they just said he just does not look like a horse who's, uh, wanting to be here or wanting to run. Despite that, he just kept on, you know, trying, kept on finishing well and winning. And he was winning in town and he was competitive in, in stakes races. And he was, you know, this was all while looking like he, you know, was carrying 400 kilos of wool. Um, so we, we knew that we had, we were going to have a pretty exciting staying prospect, uh, the next prep in. And, um, he went out to the paddock and he was just not looking like he was enjoying his spell at all. And, um, you know, Trent just was like, I think this is just the sort of horse, that typical, you know, European horse that just wants to be in work always. Doesn't really matter how they look or feel.

George 21:21 Yeah, because they don't really spell it. No.

Mitch Cunningham 21:22 And so we pulled him out of the paddock and he's come back and he's dropped his coat. Now he looks, you know, he looks magnificent now, but he's, he's just this, when I say magnificent, he's dropped his coat. He's got shine, he's dappled up, but he's, he's still this wiry, weak looking thing who will just stay for all time. And, and we couldn't get him to, um, the Melbourne Cup last year. We haven't been able to get him to two mile yet. And, uh, I think once we get to two mile, you can really see the sort of horse he is. And so I'm, I'm really excited about him in the Sydney Cup this weekend. It's his first go at two mile. He sort of failed that way of going last prep. He much preferred going around on the Melbourne leg. And, um, and so it's a little bit of an unknown, uh, going the Sydney way. Well, that said in Ascot is that way. Exactly. And so that was why we're confused is that he's won on that leg at Ascot. And so I remember the post-race report after he got rolled in Sydney and he was just like, maybe he just doesn't like going that way. But I think the conversations have been, you know, he's won like a very good horse in, in, uh, in England that way going. So I, I, I, I suspect he'll handle it. And I think he's going to be, I haven't seen that. I looked in the market 20 minutes ago. It's not out yet.

22:44 Overseas mares and what the market wants

George 22:44 To the punters, too bad, too sad this time. But we'll be on. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I, I only put this in if he wins. Yeah, cut. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. And you bought, you bought a couple of mares over there, too. Like, how important do you think that is for a breeder to diversify your broodmare band and try to introduce those new bloodlines, Tosh?

Mitch Cunningham 23:09 Well, I think it's just a point of difference. And I, I don't think you want to be too skewed towards that. You know, you, you have to understand that the market here is after, uh, precocity, uh, colonial stallions. They want to see the horse winning in Australia and then buying its prodigy. You know, so it's, if you look at, I think a very good example is we're involved with State of Rest. And I think we, we've only got 5% of them or anything. But, you know, nonetheless, he won four group ones in four different countries. He won a cocks plate and beat Animo in the cocks plate, albeit in, you know, maybe contentious circumstances. But in the end, it steward's glitter and he won, right? Animo, the only time they ever faced lost to State of Rest and then won, obviously, a hell of a lot of group ones. And as a champion horse, we've bred to him. We, we love Animo. But he's standing at 120, I think it was, and State of Rest is standing at 44. And so that is a clear indication that the market does not care about what goes on outside of Australia. They want to have seen it, you know, happen here and they want to, they want to be buying from those colonial stallions. And so when you look at mares, there's definitely a place for buying those overseas bloodlines and bringing them back. And I think it adds, adds a bit of variety to your draft, but you can't be too heavy on it. You're going to be clear on what the market's after. So that said, we, we do shop a lot over there and, and, um, you know, we had a mare who we bought called Edith Piaf, who's a Le Havre mare, a half the home of the brave. And she was a, I think a million pound, million guinea yearling who never raced. And we bought her privately in file to Frankel and we brought her out here. And the first Frankel, uh, out of her cult we sold at Magic's this year for 750,000. So the market, you know, the market are after them, but it's just a small, more niche corner of the market. So, so we, we will continue to buy and shop over there, but I can't see, I can't see European mares making up more than 5% of our broodmo band.

25:36 How the group came to own Storm Boy

George 25:36 And then you said like that the market wants that colonial Australian speed and everything. So how did it come back that you got involved in a justify call that ended up being stormed by?

Mitch Cunningham 25:49 Yeah. So justify, uh, came out to Australia and was covering and we were looking at all the justifiers and didn't love any of the ones we saw the first year. Um, I think more looking at through the lens of American Pharaoh coming out and not firing. And I think everyone was a little bit sort of gun shy on a triple crown winner coming out and, and working here at Dirt Horse. And so we were, to be honest, we were of the opinion we're just going to let someone else find out. And if he fires, we'll jump in. Yeah. I'd rather not be the, the, the one who finds out that they're not going to work here. And so we stayed off and then learning to fly came out. Um, you know, and it was like, oh, we're learning to fly is out of a fast nightmare and she didn't look like the typical justifiers. And so that's just an anomaly. But then he went again and again, and then he was getting, you know, city of Troy and he's just getting these horses all over the world, winning all the big races. And we were just like, oh ***, we've, uh, we've, we've, we've pulled the wrong rein here. And, um, I remember the conversation between, uh, Jim Clark and myself, uh, maybe a week prior saying we really need to start looking at Justify. And, um, I get an email from Gay Waterhouse a week later who trains a lot of our horses, Gay and Adrian, and, and, uh, they're advertising this, this, uh, you know, magnificent, magnificent looking Justify Colt out of a fast nightmare. Um, you know, and a granddaughter of sea change, grandson of sea change. And we just immediately called Claudia. We had marked it a two and a half, which is very high, um, on our rating scale at the yearling sale. Um, but we were never going to buy it at the yearling sale. And, um, I called Claudia Miller and said, how much of it, uh, is how much of it can we take? And she said, well, how much of it do you want? Okay. You're going to have 25%. She said, it's yours. 25% is fine. And, um, you know, as it turns out, he, he, he was storm boy. Um, funnily enough, I got a call from, yeah, yeah. Your memory lost the slipper. Um, funnily enough, I got a call from Claudia who's, who's obviously, you know, uh, remarkable at her job and, and, uh, she called me and said, Hey, listen, um, I know you've taken 25% of storm boy, but one of our good owners is, is, um, has missed out cause it sold really quickly. It's missed out. And would you mind, you know, are you open to selling down 5% of your, uh, of your share in storm? I was like, yeah, that's fine. That's fine. It's fine. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I don't know who it was. They won't tell me, but, but anyway, that's, that's the only tragic part of the whole story. Cause it was just such a fun, fun, um, and you know, I don't look at it. I don't look at that anything other than a funny story, but, um, he, so yeah, we were in, in, in storm boy from that point on. Um, we, I remember the first time I saw him, we went and saw, uh, our horses were gay and Adrian and storm boy came out of the box and he just took my breath away. Like he didn't look like a two year old. Um, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well he, he's, he, he just, you should have seen it. He came out and he just filled the eye and we'd seen all our horses that day. And I turned to Jim and both of us just like looked like we'd seen a ghost cause he was just such a physical presence. And, and, um, I think it was Emma was showing us the horse and put the horse away and we were just like, she was like, who's your favorite today? I'm like, well, storm, storm boy was pretty impressive. Um, anyway, he, he hadn't trialed at this point. He hadn't trialed twice and won by panels. And then I was on a, um, um, I was on a, and, and after the trials, I was already getting texts from the boys at Coolmore being like, Hey, listen, keep us in the loop around that horse. In fact, I got, I got messages from, from most studs about the big stallion studs about like, Hey, what's the go with that horse? What's the ownership of the horse? You know? Yeah. Did you just send back that dollar emoji? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I sent back the zipped mouth emoji. Um, and so, um, we were on the way to Tatsale in December, the Mersale. And I was on a, we were flying while Stormway had his first start in Sydney and, um, landed to like a thousand text messages from everyone. It's been like, did you see your horse? What about that horse? And, and, um, the one thing about it is he, we've had a lot of horses trial like superstars and then get rolled at their first start, you know, and I was a little concerned cause he had both trials, he jumped from an inside barrier and had been scrubbed to, to, uh, muster. And I thought to myself, maybe he had just taken a position up on speed and, and broke the hearts of the horses. And then during sort of, uh, uh, race conditions that maybe the, the tempo will be different and it's just going to be a different story. And maybe I was just being a pessimist as most sort of racing people are, but he, he won, he won so well and then went to, um, went to Brisbane, which is the first time I'd seen him, um, race in the flesh. And, and, uh, he won the BJ McLaughlin, but he won it in a way whilst to the eye, it didn't seem like he was, um, you know, going to win the Magic Millions by however much he won. He, he, he actually had to do a hell of a lot of work cause he missed the start, had to make a move mid race and was wide. He had a lot of those, um, Queensland horses eyeballing him. It was just not a race that typically a two year old can do what he did in, um, and he finished off really well. And then, um, obviously Magic Millions happened, which I don't think anyone expected. Um, maybe, maybe the stable did, but I can tell you that no one, no one had, um, alluded to us that he was going to be winning by the margin that he did and with the rating he did in the time that he did. So that was a pretty extraordinary day. Um, and, um, and I, we had already by that point been having conversations with, with the, the, the, the stud farms about the possibility of them coming in. Um, the ownership group were genuinely pretty resolute on not selling him until after the slipper. Um, that included us.

33:00 Negotiating Storm Boy's sale

George 33:00 And who does the negotiations at that point?

Mitch Cunningham 33:03 The negotiations were Jim Clark and myself. Uh, we were the managing owner of Stormboy and Jim works for me and, and the biggest shareholder. Yeah. Yeah. And, um, it was, you know, Jim's a very experienced guy who, who has worked, you know, been in the industry and he's my age, but he's been in the industry for a really long time and, and, um, has a lot of experience all over the world. And, um, the, the group were pretty resolute that they weren't going to sell Stormboy until the slipper. Um, especially at that point, the rating that he had run at Magic Millions was, so I think it was, I mean, I think he rated 105 or something, um, which that rating alone would have won, I think most slippers. So they typically improve from, from then to, to the slipper. So, you know, I think there was a reason all the studs were knocking because I think there was probably no, at that point, no better credentialed, um, stud prospect at that point in the year in some time. And so we, we were having conversations about how to strategically navigate what was going on and we'd never been in this position before. Um, the conversation quickly changed to what if we could extract the value for what it'd be worth after winning the slipper, we'd get it now, you know? And so obviously tied in with kickers, he needed to still win the slipper, but we would be able to take a bit of, I guess, de-risk, you know, um, whilst also realizing full value for him, should he win the slipper? And I guess that sort of ambition, um, uh, would put off my studs, but I think if any studs really showed a meaningful intent with them understanding that they were the metrics we were working towards, I think it showed that they were, you know, serious players in, in, in the negotiation and that we, we had, um, I think five offers on the day. Um, we'd locked ourselves in, in Adrian's office at Tulloch Lodge. It was Jim Clark, Adrian and myself. And we said office need to be in by midday on the Monday and nothing had come in at, I think it was 11 57. We didn't have anything. And what we did have was two of the studs we thought were going to be big players back out, right? They called us and said, we're not going to put an offer in because we know what you're after and good luck to you. Um, and we had told the studs that the, the offer, whoever had the biggest offer first was going to get first crack at, uh, the negotiation. And, um, there was two that came in, um, uh, I can't really speak on who was there, but obviously Coolmore were because Coolmore ended up buying it and, and Coolmore, um, you know, full credit to them that they, they, they clearly wanted to buy the horse. And so they, um, they, they had a structure which, with which they wanted to buy the horse. It was a structure with, uh, which we as an ownership group, uh, could all agree to and, and, and could endorse to the broader group. And, and, um, a storm boy was sold. It was about eight hours that we were going back and forth, but we eventually landed on a deal, which, which, um, made sense for both parties. And, um, I think that's all been pretty well documented and, and, um, unfortunately he didn't go out and win the slipper, but I do, I do think that he's the sort of horse who, um, was always going to be more of a three-year-old anyway. And I don't think that's wishful thinking or making myself feel better. I mean, obviously I would love to see him win the slipper, but he, it was, cause Adam Hieronymus said to us after, I think he'll win the triple crown, but the slipper will be the hardest race for him. Right. And I think he'll get better as the trip gets further. Um, unfortunately he was just tired by the time the, the, I think, I think the, the slipper took a lot out of him. And then by the time we got to the size, he was just not the same horse at all. Um, but I was always so, I guess, comforted by the fact that I feel like when he does win his group ones, as you say, he's going to be a mile or 10 furlong horse, but he's always going to have on his CV that magic millions wins, which it's two year old precocity speed. He rated, you know, incredibly on the day. He ran an incredible time. So it's to say that that's right. Well, that's right. But you go, exactly, exactly. And you go to, you go to start and say, look at all these group ones. He's won hopefully. Um, but remember, you remember that got that, that Magic Millions win. Yeah. Yeah. So that's always there. And I know it's a restricted listed race, but we all know that it's one of the two old races we target. And you know, it's, it's the, it's

George 38:17 pre Christmas. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And again, if he stays healthy and everything

38:25 After the Slipper: Storm Boy's future

Mitch Cunningham 38:25 goes to plan, a Cox plate looks pretty good. Well, Cox, yeah, you know, and you know, you know, the three year old Cox plate winners, right? It's, it's out of this world, you know, the Savabille, Stata Rest, so you think, uh, Ocean Park, Seamus Ward, Adelaide, I suppose also, I mean like this Savabille, they'll say, so like there's, they're the, they go on to the start and they do it, right? And they're there, but he will always have that Magic Millions win there. And you know what, in the end, if you take the financial implications out of him not winning the slipper, if you removed all that and you just watched the slipper, you would say that was an enormous run. It was, wrong part of the track. Yeah. You can go on. Yeah. So, um, I must say the first time I ever felt sort of really uneasy going into race was the size, not because I didn't think he was ready for the size, but I just felt like there is a chance here, uh, he's not going to show up and he didn't show up. So, um, but I, if I had my time again, uh, you know, uh, it was still the right decision to run him. I agree. Cause you got, it's a, it's a incredibly valuable route to your own race for his stud credential. But you know, in hindsight, there's not a huge surprise that he's, that

George 39:38 he just floundered that day. Yeah. Have you found at all, like some people are now doubting

Mitch Cunningham 39:44 him for sure. People were doubting him after his skyline win, you know, on a testing track they're like, Oh, maybe he's not a champ. And the thing is people jump on and off bandwagons faster than, you know, anything like it's, it's, we see it all the time. Yeah. It's ridiculous. Even when he was winning, like the narrative was, I thought he'd win a bit better than that. Yeah. But equally, I thought he'd win better than that. Or it's like, it's like, Oh, he's the best, he's the best stallion prospect in history. He's the best two year old to come out. Equally as absurd, you know, like you don't know anything about the horse. He's just winning well. And he's, but I think now it's like, Oh, storm boy, what storm boy. And you know, the worst thing you can do is go on Twitter after you get rolled in a race like that, because it's just, you know, a pretty dark place. But the truth is he, he's, he does have to go and do it now. Yeah. He's got to go and win a group.

George 40:46 Step up. Come on, let's go. Yeah. But do you think it's taken a bit of pressure off too?

Mitch Cunningham 40:51 Yeah. I suppose. Yeah. I've not really thought of it that way, but it would have. I think the whole…

George 40:56 Chilly wins the first group one again.

Mitch Cunningham 40:58 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. And then all of a sudden he's, he's, you know, so we'll see. It's, look, it's been, it's been an extraordinary experience with storm boys. He's given us so much. He's given us so much fun. That day at Magic Millions with my family was one of the best days I've ever had in my life.

41:14 Most meaningful win and how hard winning is

George 41:14 And has that been your biggest win?

Mitch Cunningham 41:17 Yeah. Oh, it's, it's, it's our most meaningful win. I mean, we were at Royal Ascot when State Arrest won the, the Prince of Wales, but we were a tiny showldering it and, and, um, we bought into the horse after the Cox Plate. So it's, it was still at Nick, you know, one of the best days ever, but it's, it's, it was different with Storm Boy for sure.

George 41:37 Yeah. No. And so he's come out of that run well, like he'll go for a break.

Mitch Cunningham 41:41 Yeah. He's in a paddock now. Yeah. He's just going to have a well-owned break. Yeah.

George 41:44 Yeah. Yeah. Everyone would be delighted that he's not gone. At the end of the day, we, we had a horse win the other week and we won't mention what, uh, what horse it was and what owner it was, but you get a phone call and you can genuinely see she wants 1400 and she won over a thousand and the last 75 was so soft, but only just got warm. It's like she won by what? One? Yeah. 1.1 or something, but a $1.22 favorite. I get a phone call. It hasn't even cooled down yet. They're probably still in the wash bay. I thought she'd win by a lot of more than them. I'm like, are they *** people serious? I don't care if I win by a

Mitch Cunningham 42:22 nose. It's like, oh my God. It's tough going. I think, um, we haven't, we haven't, as you know, been, been racing for a long time, but we've raced with a lot of horses. Yeah. So I've, I've seen it all and I know, I know just winning a race is so hard. So hard. Anywhere? Anywhere. It doesn't matter where. I mean, look at Steffi Magnetica who came second in the group one the other day. She was getting beaten in, in, you know, out bush, you know, so it's

George 42:51 just so off air. We spoke that, uh, we took one of our horses for a kill to orange, didn't we? Yeah. And we ran into Steffi Magnetica, her bloody beyond special. Yeah, that's right.

Mitch Cunningham 43:03 Well, he's, he, he, he is known for getting the easy kill out wide, but the process works. I mean, she went on a extraordinary trajectory from that point. Once I think they get that feeling of winning, I think it can change their constitution. Um, and, and Steffi was a great example of, of a horse that was finding ways to get beat every time she run, uh, and was flighty behind the barriers, was hopping out of the barriers, was doing everything she could to get beat. And she, um, she got that win at Wellington the last two-year-old race of the season and then had a break and went to orange and she won there and just went on to improve and improve and improve every run from there. And it, uh, it finished with a second in the, um, second by nose in the, in the surround stakes, the group one. That's all to me. You

43:58 Two-year and ten-year plans

George 43:58 just wrecked our price next start. The form will suck up. Um, so what's the future look like, mate, for, for you guys? Where do you see yourself in, let's be realistic, say two

Mitch Cunningham 44:11 years? Two years I, I, I see, um, us being a well-established broodmare farm, selling, selling yearlings at the top end of the market consistently. Um, and being a brand people want to buy off, you know, and people are really interested and excited to buy off us. Uh, you know, the buyers looking at Ridgemont, uh, a bit like they look at, you know, a mill park, you know, a farm that just breeds really tough horses. Um, so that's two years from now, but I'm a bit more lofty with our ambition over 10 years. I like to think that, you know, there's a potential we move into the, um, the stallion game.

George 44:50 It scares me to think where you could be in 10 years because you bought your first horse in 2017. Yeah. Look, it's, yeah, there's a lot of luck with that. You know, we've been

Mitch Cunningham 45:02 lucky. Um, but we're, we're, we're, we're, yeah, totally focused on making this broodmare farm, um, uh, profitable and successful. Um, in the back of my mind, I do, uh, you know, lay in bed at night thinking a little bit about what it'd be like to move into the stallion side of things, not in a rush, but I think probably knowing myself and knowing my family and knowing our staff, I think that's probably where we will, uh, look to move to in, in,

George 45:38 you know, sometime in the next decade. And I hope the next storm boy might be standing here. Yeah. Well, and not giving away 5%. Yeah. That's right. No one's stunk. No, it's incredible. Thanks very much for your time and showing us the farm and yeah, it's amazing. I'm so impressed with everything you've built and I've no doubt Ridgemont is definitely going to be a name. A lot of people are going to be hearing a lot more about in

Mitch Cunningham 46:04 the future. Yeah. Thanks George. Thanks Sean. You know, it's just, uh, appreciate you taking time to come and have a yarn. It's great.

George 46:10 Thank you. And, uh,